Nissan Leaf to be victim of heavy dealer price gouging?

[Cacti]

http://green.autoblog.com/2010/05/19/nissan-leaf-to-be-victim-of-dealer-pricing-gouging/


"How can dealers be prevented from price gouging customers to guarantee that the price of a Leaf won't skyrocket as soon as it hits the lot? To this, Nissan has no answer. The company told GM-Volt.com that it releases a manufacturer's suggested retail price but has no control over individual dealer pricing."

 

[mwalsh]

http://green.autoblog.com/2010/05/19/nissan-leaf-to-be-victim-of-dealer-pricing-gouging/

I think we have to be supportive of each other, lauding dealers who charge MSRP and shaming dealers who have the audacity to mark-up. That way, we can collectively steer clear of the ones who mark-up.

 

[garygid]

Hopefully, ... you will be able to "make a deal" in August with any Nissan LEAF dealer, and just refuse to deal with those adding unwanted "adjustments".

Then, you (or your "contracted" dealer) tells NissanUSA where to deliver your vehicle?

 

[mitch672]

It's really simple, if you can't get it for MSRP, then just walk away, if every dealer in your area is gouging.

After all, it is just a car. No one "has" to have it, we all have other cars currently. if enough refuse to be gouged, Leaf sales will plummet, and in a short while you will be able to return to the dealer and get it for a heavily discounted price OFF MSRP. The general public is NOT lining up to buy these, and is still very skeptical of electric cars. Piss off the early adopters, the Leaf is guranteed to fail.

 

[garygid]

Signing up for an almost $40,000 car purchase ... actually boggles my mind!

 

[EVDRIVER]

http://green.autoblog.com/2010/05/19/nissan-leaf-to-be-victim-of-dealer-pricing-gouging/

I think we have to be supportive of each other, lauding dealers who charge MSRP and shaming dealers who have the audacity to mark-up. That way, we can collectively steer clear of the ones who mark-up.

Better yet, let's all walk and demand invoice price and use that as a starting point for negotiation.

 

[Gonewild]

Many dealer are Nissan owned dealerships so they will keep prices low at MSRP. So the other dealer who would try to charge more would just not get the sale. As a registered buyer I have the right to pick my dealer. The dealer does not get cars sent to them to fill there lots. So when I make my order the car is sent to my dealer not to a dealer they want.

So there should not be a price increase.

 

[1051]

http://green.autoblog.com/2010/05/19/nissan-leaf-to-be-victim-of-dealer-pricing-gouging/

I think we have to be supportive of each other, lauding dealers who charge MSRP and shaming dealers who have the audacity to mark-up. That way, we can collectively steer clear of the ones who mark-up.

Better yet, let's all walk and demand invoice price and use that as a starting point for negotiation.

We need to find one dealer that will give us invoice price in our area and we all buy from that dealer.

 

[1051]

Signing up for an almost $40,000 car purchase ... actually boggles my mind!

My mind also.

 

[garygid]

Any idea what the "invoice" price would be?
Is that including the after-sale dealer "kickbacks"?

Expect approx $850 "destination" charge.
What other additions should one expect?
Thanks

 

[planet4ever]

Any idea what the "invoice" price would be?
Is that including the after-sale dealer "kickbacks"?

Expect approx $850 "destination" charge.
What other additions should one expect?
Thanks

On the Nissan Leaf website if you select "buy" and then "packages + features" you see the "net" purchase prices and lease prices, but down near the bottom it says "Disclaimer". I didn't realize it until recently, but that's a little scrollable box with a lot of fine print and all sorts of sneaky disclaimers.

- Yes, there's an $820 destination charge
- For lease, there is a $595 acquisition fee, not included in the $1999
- The $349 and $379 lease prices are only "examples"
- The real lease prices will be announced in December

There is more. It would be advisable to read and understand, or get professional help in doing so.

 

[Bicster]

FWIW, the dealer I selected claimed to have a long history of never charging over MSRP. Of course, those words were spoken by a car salesman. :lol:

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

It's really simple, if you can't get it for MSRP, then just walk away, if every dealer in your area is gouging.

After all, it is just a car. No one "has" to have it, we all have other cars currently. if enough refuse to be gouged, Leaf sales will plummet, and in a short while you will be able to return to the dealer and get it for a heavily discounted price OFF MSRP. The general public is NOT lining up to buy these, and is still very skeptical of electric cars. Piss off the early adopters, the Leaf is guranteed to fail.

IMO you couldn't be more correct mitch. With the Dow off a solid 10% and the european debt crisis in full swing, the sentiment surrounding the global economic picture is bleak at best, and that's weighing heavily on oil prices. We could be looking at $2 gas here in a few months.

I'd feel like a total idiot to win the battle to be the first on the block with a Leaf by paying $5k over sticker only to find I could have waited a few months and gotten one off the lot for $1500 off MSRP. Don't laugh, it has happened with the Prius and it can certainly happen with the Leaf.

Not to mention maybe this is one time you don't really want to be first. Let Lance get the bugs worked out for us.

 

[mwalsh]

Not to mention maybe this is one time you don't really want to be first. Let Lance get the bugs worked out for us.

LOL! I was thinking the same thing....3-4 months for him to find things that need fixes!

 

[1051]

Invoice is probably around 31K, if you subtract the $7,500 Fed rebate you would have a cost of $23,500, and if still available in california after the $5k rebate you would have a net cost of around $18,500. What we really need to know is what the money factor is for the lease and residual value. I would think we can cut a deal on the Leaf just like any other car you buy or lease. We have to remember and the dealers have to know is we can change dealers and they will get Zero when it is time to talk price. I took the dealer cost of one of the other Nissans that was close to the retail of the Leaf to come up the the 31K.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Not to mention maybe this is one time you don't really want to be first. Let Lance get the bugs worked out for us.

LOL! I was thinking the same thing....3-4 months for him to find things that need fixes!

Plus if it breaks down on Lance he can pull his bike out of the back and pedal home about as fast as most of us drive. No doubt he generates of lot of CO2 though, so not all that green.

 

[planet4ever]

Invoice is probably around 31K, if you subtract the $7,500 Fed rebate you would have a cost of $23,500, and if still available in california after the $5k rebate you would have a net cost of around $18,500. What we really need to know is what the money factor is for the lease and residual value. I would think we can cut a deal on the Leaf just like any other car you buy or lease. We have to remember and the dealers have to know is we can change dealers and they will get Zero when it is time to talk price. I took the dealer cost of one of the other Nissans that was close to the retail of the Leaf to come up the the 31K.

You could be right on the invoice, but if the dealer doesn't get some cut out of it they will be out of business soon. Don't forget that any dealer planning to be authorized for the Leaf is going to have extra expenses for new equipment and training. I suspect, given the apparent demand, that it will be a long time before you can talk them down much below MSRP.

As for lease money factor and residual value, those are two of only three variables (the third being disposition fee) I wasn't able to find in that fine print I referred to above. But fitting money factor and residual value into the values they did give, my best prediction would be residual = 53% and money factor (as of April 2010) is .003646 (i.e. APR = 8.75%). My personal guess is that the money factor (and hence the monthly lease) will have gone up a bit by the first of 2011.

 

[sjfotos]

Nissan, we love you:

According to Perry, there are major differences between a LEAF sale and a conventional car sale that should put to rest the question of price gouging. “The difference in the distribution process is, it’s not an allocation to the dealer, it’s a customer order, so [the customers] have the control,” said Perry on the sidelines of the groundbreaking event. As he explains it, if you go to any particular dealer and say ‘I have an order, would you like to deliver my lease?’ and they come back with a price $5,000 higher than list, you can simply take your order and go to another dealer. In this system, the people with multiple Nissan dealerships in their area will be at an advantage, but even the folks with only 2 or 3 within 60 miles will have excellent bargaining power.

Story here:
http://gas2.org/2010/05/26/nissan-leaf-early-adopters-wont-get-gouged-by-the-dealer-heres-why/#more-8161

 

[BrendanDolan]

Invoice is probably around 31K, if you subtract the $7,500 Fed rebate you would have a cost of $23,500, and if still available in california after the $5k rebate you would have a net cost of around $18,500. What we really need to know is what the money factor is for the lease and residual value. I would think we can cut a deal on the Leaf just like any other car you buy or lease. We have to remember and the dealers have to know is we can change dealers and they will get Zero when it is time to talk price. I took the dealer cost of one of the other Nissans that was close to the retail of the Leaf to come up the the 31K.

You could be right on the invoice, but if the dealer doesn't get some cut out of it they will be out of business soon. Don't forget that any dealer planning to be authorized for the Leaf is going to have extra expenses for new equipment and training. I suspect, given the apparent demand, that it will be a long time before you can talk them down much below MSRP.

As for lease money factor and residual value, those are two of only three variables (the third being disposition fee) I wasn't able to find in that fine print I referred to above. But fitting money factor and residual value into the values they did give, my best prediction would be residual = 53% and money factor (as of April 2010) is .003646 (i.e. APR = 8.75%). My personal guess is that the money factor (and hence the monthly lease) will have gone up a bit by the first of 2011.

It'll be interesting to see if Nissan will allow the dealers to mark up the money factor. Just like a home loan, dealers broker the loan to you from the financial institution, and are allowed to increase the money factor to make more money. In a loan, the max rate markup is 1-2%, and while I forget what the highest allowable markup is on a lease, it can change the payments drastically.

If the money factor is in the high three range, a markup into the fours is brutal...

While times have been really tight for dealers in the last few years, hopefully Nissan does something to ensure dealers don't try to go overboard on the Leaf. The ordering process should help the over MSRP issue, but only time will tell on the money factor. Assuming invoice is $31k (which seems reasonable after checking a few other Nissans in that price range), holdback is in the $860 range, so there will be more than enough to make it worthwhile for the dealer.

 

[evnow]

As for lease money factor and residual value, those are two of only three variables (the third being disposition fee) I wasn't able to find in that fine print I referred to above. But fitting money factor and residual value into the values they did give, my best prediction would be residual = 53% and money factor (as of April 2010) is .003646 (i.e. APR = 8.75%). My personal guess is that the money factor (and hence the monthly lease) will have gone up a bit by the first of 2011.

Who is "they" ?