Official Tesla Model S thread

[toasty]

just saw this flying down the highway in atlanta last week.

 

[DaveEV]

just saw this flying down the highway in atlanta last week.

No way - you spotted another LEAF on the highway while driving yours!

Oh wait - you must be referring to that big, wide black battery powered thing to your left.

 

[ztanos]

just saw this flying down the highway in atlanta last week.

No way - you spotted another LEAF on the highway while driving yours!

Oh wait - you must be referring to that big, wide black battery powered thing to your left.

Yeah, but this is Atlanta... nice to see a Model S here. Rare to see two LEAFs at the same time.

 

[GeekEV]

just saw this flying down the highway in atlanta last week.

No way - you spotted another LEAF on the highway while driving yours!

Oh wait - you must be referring to that big, wide black battery powered thing to your left.

Yeah, but this is Atlanta... nice to see a Model S here. Rare to see two LEAFs at the same time.

Even rarer, I suspect, to see two LEAFs *and* a Model S...

 

[Train]

it is not clear whether Gen III would ever compete with Leaf or just with i3.

Won't be much of a competition, when they get to "BlueStar" (Gen III), Teslas superior battery management and thermally manged pack will far exceed all of the lower end EVs on the market.
Tesla is really the only manufacturer that doesn't have an axe (Read: ICE) to grind.
They are not in competition with themselves, as ALL other manufacturers are, including Nissan.

Also they are not trying to compete with other EVs, that's not what they do, or their mission.
They are displacing full ICE vehicles with a superior vehicle/driving experience, no compromises.

You're assuming Tesla will still be solvent at this time. I'm sure a lot of guys had their 2nd Delorean picked out as well.

 

[Train]

The only person buying this car should be someone who does not mind losing $90,000.

If you are buying a $90,000 electric car from a start up, and you make less than $300,000K a year, your priorities are out of whack. SERIOUSLY out of whack. Unless you have significant savings or a consistent seven figure income, this is foolish.

Eventually, time will pass and it will be just be a four door sedan in your garage. It will be then that buyer's remorse will hit and you'll look at it and say "What the hell was I thinking?"

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

i know some pretty sane people who bought one and pretty sure they no where near 300K. one person I know is probably in the 150K range in combined income but not really sure of that either.

 

[Train]

This all driven by emotion. I understand how sitting in a cool car in the dealership can suddenly have you signing papers a couple hours later. But, geez this is emotion run amok.

Many are going to come to seriously regret this purchase. Buyer's remorse is going to be fierce. Again, you're the starting quarterback of the NE Patriots, have at it. You can pay that car off with a couple minutes of play.

GaslessinSeattle, you still have time to get your deposit back and be rational again.

 

[Viktor]

Well - some people just want the newest and greatest no matter the money. It does go against my religion, but who are we to judge early adopters? Much better investment that 2-3 carats diamond (even so my wife might argue) :shock: How come girls never regrets those kind of purchases?

 

[Train]

Sure, it's their decision. But in this case, the latest and greatest is a significant investment of money.

I am not judging anyone. I'm just suggesting a little more rational thought.

And a diamond is a much better investment.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

i dont see it that way. the fuel costs alone can easily save you $3000-$4000 a year over a comparable large car. So just about anyone who is in the mid-large Mercedes class would be there. Instead of paying $60,000 for it and paying for gas , get a Tesla for $85,000 and in 5 years its a break even game.

 

[Viktor]

And a diamond is a much better investment.

Says who? Ever tried to sell one?

Not to mentioned artificial ones :ugeek:

 

[evnow]

i dont see it that way. the fuel costs alone can easily save you $3000-$4000 a year over a comparable large car. So just about anyone who is in the mid-large Mercedes class would be there. Instead of paying $60,000 for it and paying for gas , get a Tesla for $85,000 and in 5 years its a break even game.

That would probably make sense (though not real financial, once you consider capital cost).

But, we are talking about usual Civic buyers, suddenly buying a Model S.

BTW, when I brought this up a few pages back - it wasn't even saying anything about their decision. All I was saying was, Tesla won't be able to count on such buyers in the long term.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Right and Tesla knows that which is why they are using the knowledge gained now to develop the $35,000 Family car or thereabouts.
I think every auto manufacturer has come to realize that We as consumers are not sophisticated enough to realize that the extra money we pay now will come back to us double by not buying gas.

look at the logistics

buy a $20,000 car @ 4% for 6 years and pay $312 a month in car payments and say about $150 a month for gas (dont drive much)

or buy an EV for $30,000 after incentives same terms with $469 payments.

its essentially the same either way but people freak out because the $469 is a guaranteed bill (as if someone would park their car to avoid paying for gas??) and "just over $300" sounds much better than "almost $500" but its not.

now, there are other maintenance costs to consider as well along with electricity which i proved can be negligible as least for now (i quick charged 34 times in the Month of October. my home electric bill for the LEAF was about $12 but only because I got tired of it and slacked off the last few days of the month... :roll: )

now the above is gleamed from real conversations with real people...

 

[Train]

i dont see it that way. the fuel costs alone can easily save you $3000-$4000 a year over a comparable large car. So just about anyone who is in the mid-large Mercedes class would be there. Instead of paying $60,000 for it and paying for gas , get a Tesla for $85,000 and in 5 years its a break even game.

And in a couple more years, then what? A new $12,000 battery? There goes any savings. This is a fallacy this savings on fuel. You'll have to eventually pay it back with a new battery. You even mentioned that yourself a few pages back.

A car getting 22 mpg at 15,000 miles per year would get you near $3000 in yearly fuel costs. Now subtract the electricity cost. So the savings is closer to $2000.

Not to mention my point was not spending that ridiculous an amount of money for a car in the first place if you're pinching pennies. How does someone go from Prius or a Leaf to a Tesla S? Only by draining your savings (a 401K, gads...even worse) or by paying an exorbitant monthly payment for what is just a car.

There's no doubt the thing performs and is a technological marvel. But this car is for athletes, movies stars, CEO's, executives and people who can throw away money.

If you don't make that kind of cash, you shouldn't be buying this car.

I know the truth hurts, but...there it is. It's tough love. Some are in dire need of it.

 

[coolfilmaker]

Frankly I think spending $30,000 on a poorly engineered car like the Leaf is a much worse idea than spending $95,000 on a well engineered car like the Model S. Also, it'll be 20 years before anybody's Model S battery pack has the range of a leaf. There's no reason to think that you'll have to replace it after 8 years.

 

[Train]

Frankly I think spending $30,000 on a poorly engineered car like the Leaf is a much worse idea than spending $95,000 on a well engineered car like the Model S. Also, it'll be 20 years before anybody's Model S battery pack has the range of a leaf. There's no reason to think that you'll have to replace it after 8 years.

Nah, no reason at all. :lol: Because we all know the Leaf's was designed to last 8 years as well with only 15% degradation. And we all know Tesla is rolling cash right now, too. But perhaps, if Tesla is still solvent in 8 years, I guess we'll find out.

Eight years is a long time. 20 years? Geez. Think of the computers that were built in 1992. Still got that 386 printing out posters and greeting cards with Banner Maker? How many here have cars from 20 years ago? That's what I thought. So it doesn't matter what the battery pack will do in 20 years because it will either have long since been replaced, has been sitting in a recycle yard for years since Tesla went out of business, or the car no longer exists or runs.

 

[ebill3]

And a diamond is a much better investment.

Hogwash!

Bill

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

LOL, it's driven by a lot of things, emotion being one. One thing it is not driven by is knee jerk impulsiveness as you imply. I'm certainly not suggesting anyone do anything reckless and I do stand by the basic premiss that one should never gamble what one can not afford to lose. The final decision to sign the papers took months of consideration and planning. When we really want something, we determine if it's feasible and if so, plan for it over time at the expense of other things or investments, which is what we have done.

For instance, we took an extended drive in an actual production signature S yesterday thanks to a generous owner. this was my fourth test drive over 6 months. My wife and I were nothing short of amazed. We actually got to open it up on the freeway, the torque never let up, kept up a spine tingling acceleration well above 80, I had to let up on the accelerator long before we found any kind of plateau. there are just so many little and big surprises that Tesla has nailed and is still adding on with new software updates, so numerous that it just takes time with the car to really take it all in. If you are impressed with what you see on the website, you will be blown away with all the little goodies in the real life version.

For anyone wondering, the production units are even a cut above the test drive vehicles Tesla offers. The actual sound upgrade is fantastic in real life. the turn by turn Nav comes up not only in the high definition screen but also in a close up view on the dash, to the left of the speedometer, it's very well thought out. whatever you are streaming or playing is shown not only on the music screen but also on the dash to the right of the speedometer. both portions of the screen to either side of the speedometer can be customized and controlled by the steering wheel scrolls (very handy little multifunction buttons), which of course is best done when parked until you become very familiar with it. The fit and finish of the production car is fantastic, little things I'd noticed were sub par in the test car had been tightened up in the final product. the heat pump works very well for keeping the cabin as warm as you like without robbing so much range. The storage space is on par with our highlander SUV, the S can even, as many know, be ordered with a third row of child jump seats in the back, making it capable of holding 7 people. The third row seats neatly fold down flat when not used, leaving a nice big trunk. For it's outward size, the S has a defying amount of internal space. So, for comparison with our hybrid highlander, which was $50K and gets somewhere between 22 and 27 mpg typically and has no where near the handling and pick up, it's really not as far a reach. for a family of four that fills a seven seat vehicle with out of town family on a regular basis, honestly, it's remarkably capable. the one thing it is not, is all wheel drive and that is the main reason we are planning to sell our Leaf and not our highlander, we need all wheel drive for the snow in the winter, otherwise the Leaf would make a great pair with the S.

This all driven by emotion. I understand how sitting in a cool car in the dealership can suddenly have you signing papers a couple hours later. But, geez this is emotion run amok.

Many are going to come to seriously regret this purchase. Buyer's remorse is going to be fierce. Again, you're the starting quarterback of the NE Patriots, have at it. You can pay that car off with a couple minutes of play.

GaslessinSeattle, you still have time to get your deposit back and be rational again.

 

[mitch672]

You're assuming Tesla will still be solvent at this time. I'm sure a lot of guys had their 2nd Delorean picked out as well.

If they aren't around its because they where acquired by another auto mfr, most likely Dalmer, who already owns %10 of Tesla, or Toyota could change ther antiEV sentiment and also be a possible Tesla IP buyer.

If its not clear to you that Tesla has formed strategic partnerships in the automotive business, and will be highly valued for their IP, should Elon & Co decide to sell. There's very little chance of a Tesla bankruptcy because there brand and IP are highly valued, it will be more of a bidding war than an auction, but that's not a likely outcome.

Tesla has the mfr rate up to a level where the labor costs are reasonable, and they are making money on the Model S, they are on track for a $1.6 billion in Model S sales for 2013, can't wait for the 4th quarter numbers, it's going to cause a lot of pain for the pessimists.

What's actually happening is, as the Model S gets out into "the real world" and more and more people are exposed to it, the daily reservation rate is increasing. Soon 2013 production will be sold out. They are on track to make 20,000/year now. You don't have to be wealthy to afford one, just manage your money wisely, and have some savings set aside. I've owned 4 Prius, and my current one is the Plug in, but I'm getting a Model S, and I don't need to justify it to anyone, especially you.