Revision 2 upgrade for Nissan EVSE - Allows full level 2!

[edatoakrun]

I think Phil should get a cut of this for his work with the Nissan L1. What say you guys?

Well, if they were to only give me 1% of that, I could work on bringing the "dream" portable low-cost EVSE to market. This would give almost anyone overnight charge capability for a low-cost.

> 100-250v universal input voltage, 50/60hz.
> Interchangeable plug module on back supports all worldwide plug types with a simple easily changed module.
> Plug module can swivel 360 degrees to support any outlet installation without stress on outlet or cable.
> Hardware capable of up to 20A.
> Easy user amperage selection with instant LED verification of selection.
> Bright blue LED display shows instant kW, Volts, Amps, PF, session charge time, total time, total charges.
> Intelligent Auto-Backoff feature allows temporary charge current reduction on shared circuits to avoid overloads.
> Lightweight and no bulky boxes in the middle of the cable. All electronics inside the plug housing.
> Full diagnostic capability lets you know if something is wrong.

Exactly.

And with true mass production, couldn't this be sold profitably for only a few hundred bucks?

I'm using your 16 amp upgrade as my sole EVSE, while I wait for you (or others) to produce something better.

I had planned on just using L1 at home, but your upgrade has been a real improvement. I haven't been able to do a control test of efficiency compared to L1 yet, but it seems to close to 15%. An 11 bar recharge now takes only about 21 kWh at the wall, as compared to 24 kWh on L1, as measured by kill-o-watt.

I haven't got my adapter kit completed yet, but have already scouted some suitable 240v locations.

Portable L2 looks to be a real game changer for "early adopters" (like me) who live in areas where the J1772 roll-out is nonexistent.

Thanks, Phil

 

[jimcmorr]

I would vote for this! If we start manufacturing stuff on our soil again it would be a big help to our economy!

...if they were to only give me 1% of that, I could work on bringing the "dream" portable low-cost EVSE to market. This would give almost anyone overnight charge capability for a low-cost.

Widespread innovation of this kind is what may bring our country out of the deepening mess we have found ourselves in.

 

[Volusiano]

Any comment on the newly announced Clipper Creek LCS-25 portable charging station? At $995 and 7 lbs, even though it'll be sold as a wall unit, who's to say people won't bother installing it on the wall and instead will keep it loose so that it can be portable as well if needed?

http://www.allcarselectric.com/news/1061614_clipper-creek-unveils-smallest-electric-car-charging-station-yet

Price wise, the Panasonic EVSE that comes with the Leaf will end up being close to the $1K range already with the Rev2 upgrade (if you were to buy one instead of using the included one). So they're neck to neck in price. So how do you think they compare in the other departments?

 

[Ingineer]

Any comment on the newly announced Clipper Creek LCS-25 portable charging station? At $995 and 7 lbs, even though it'll be sold as a wall unit, who's to say people won't bother installing it on the wall and instead will keep it loose so that it can be portable as well if needed?

http://www.allcarselectric.com/news/1061614_clipper-creek-unveils-smallest-electric-car-charging-station-yet

Price wise, the Panasonic EVSE that comes with the Leaf will end up being close to the $1K range already with the Rev2 upgrade (if you were to buy one instead of using the included one). So they're neck to neck in price. So how do you think they compare in the other departments?

Where did you get "close to $1k"? Cost of upgrade is $239, add $48 for the Rev 2 to give you full 16A level 2, and shipping, and your total is $307 delivered. Our upgraded EVSE weighs 3lbs, and the total, with cord and J-plug is 8lbs. If you want a second one outright, you can buy one new for $468 (parts.com). So $468+$307=$775. $995-$775=$220 which is a significant savings, is well proven, and is available now.

If you don't want an upgrade, the better deal is the $750 SPX unit, but that's still vaporware.

(not to toot my own horn, but the whole reason I started doing this is because of $1k EVSE pricing!)

-Phil

 

[Volusiano]

Any comment on the newly announced Clipper Creek LCS-25 portable charging station? At $995 and 7 lbs, even though it'll be sold as a wall unit, who's to say people won't bother installing it on the wall and instead will keep it loose so that it can be portable as well if needed?

http://www.allcarselectric.com/news/1061614_clipper-creek-unveils-smallest-electric-car-charging-station-yet

Price wise, the Panasonic EVSE that comes with the Leaf will end up being close to the $1K range already with the Rev2 upgrade (if you were to buy one instead of using the included one). So they're neck to neck in price. So how do you think they compare in the other departments?

Where did you get "close to $1k"? Cost of upgrade is $239, add $38 for the Rev 2 to give you full 16A level 2, and shipping, and your total is $307 delivered. Our upgraded EVSE weighs 3lbs, and the total, with cord and J-plug is 8lbs. If you want a second one outright, you can buy one new for $468 (parts.com). So $468+$307=$775. $995-$775=$220 which is a significant savings, is well proven, and is available now.

If you don't want an upgrade, the better deal is the $750 SPX unit, but that's still vaporware.

(not to toot my own horn, but the whole reason I started doing this is because of $1k EVSE pricing!)

-Phil

Wow, I didn't realize you can buy one for $468 from parts.com now. That sure is news to me. I thought it was available for purchase from Nissan dealership only because I remember reading some post that you also bought them from Nissan dealerships and there was a shortage due to high demand from people who want to get second ones with the Rev2 upgrade. I also remember we were told to insure our EVSE for $700 when we ship it out to you, so I just assume that its original/replacement cost would be close to $700 (maybe $675 or somewhere in that area if I remember correctly?).

If you can get one now from parts.com for $468, lots of people who don't have a Blink in there garage are going to want to have a backup one to keep portable in their car trunk now. I know I would if I didn't have a free Blink already installed in my garage.

 

[JPVLeaf]

(not to toot my own horn, but the whole reason I started doing this is because of $1k EVSE pricing!)

Toot away! Not only is the upgrade cost effective, but the turnaround is as quick as one would expect, IMHO.

Fri., 6/10, EVSE shipped from SoCal-OC to NoCal-Bay Area via UPS ground.
Tue., 6/14, 12p, EVSE was delivered in NoCal (would've gotten there 6/13 if not for UPS misdirect)
Tue., 6/14, 5:30p, EVSE with Rev2 was shipped out of NoCal
Thu., 6/16, end-of-day, EVSE estimated delivery in SoCal.

After having used MWalsh's upgraded EVSE for almost a week now (Thank you MWalsh!), I expect to be yet another happy customer.

 

[rawhog]

.

 

[Ingineer]

Your web site says $48 for rev 2.

Sorry, Typo corrected. The math was still correct. ($307 total)

 

[downeykp]

I do not see any reason why anyone would want anything other than the upgraded Level 2 evse from Phil. I have mine mounted on the wall. It works perfect and looks kind of cool and is small, (doesn't take up half of a wall).
So you upgrade level one for $307 and get another one for $775 and your total for both is $1082. Which in my case is $1000 less than what AV wanted.
Great stuff Phil, Mahalo

 

[DrRocket]

I can't believe the materials cost for a 50 AMP vs 16 AMP EVSE portable version would cost much more. While someone may want to create market segmentation with various amperage denominations, a single small portable 50 AMP EVSE for $500 would be a giant hit.

 

[Ingineer]

I can't believe the materials cost for a 50 AMP vs 16 AMP EVSE portable version would cost much more. While someone may want to create market segmentation with various amperage denominations, a single small portable 50 AMP EVSE for $500 would be a giant hit.

50 amps is going to well more than double the amount of copper needed, and the cable will get heavy, bulky, and hard to manage. Yes, it will cost significantly more, as the bulk of the cost is the heavy stuff actually carrying the current.

Not to say that $500 for a 50amp unit isn't do-able with some economy of scale.

-Phil

 

[evnow]

50 amps is going to well more than double the amount of copper needed...

Slight OT.

There was a recent program on BBC about how Wall st has taken control of the commodity market and is pumping the prices up - including copper. Goldman Sachs infact has bought some warehouses where most of the copper is stocked and their reports of the available stock of copper drives the price of copper on the international market. They interviewed the warehouse keeper and saw a lot of copper sitting there gathering dust while there is a "shortage" of copper on the international market.

BTW, expensive copper isn't good for battery prices either - most of battery by weight is copper.

 

[Ingineer]

There was a recent program on BBC about how Wall st has taken control of the commodity market and is pumping the prices up - including copper. Goldman Sachs infact has bought some warehouses where most of the copper is stocked and their reports of the available stock of copper drives the price of copper on the international market. They interviewed the warehouse keeper and saw a lot of copper sitting there gathering dust while there is a "shortage" of copper on the international market.

This is scary, and should be illegal under anti-trust statutes.

BTW, expensive copper isn't good for battery prices either - most of battery by weight is copper.

Not true, in fact a lot of battery types have zero copper. Your 12V Lead-acid car batteries for example, which are probably still the most widely used batteries in the world. (by weight for sure! =)

-Phil

 

[jimcmorr]

I can't believe the materials cost for a 50 AMP vs 16 AMP EVSE portable version would cost much more. While someone may want to create market segmentation with various amperage denominations, a single small portable 50 AMP EVSE for $500 would be a giant hit.

50 amps is going to well more than double the amount of copper needed, and the cable will get heavy, bulky, and hard to manage. Yes, it will cost significantly more, as the bulk of the cost is the heavy stuff actually carrying the current.

Not to say that $500 for a 50amp unit isn't do-able with some economy of scale.

-Phil

Phil, is aluminum a viable alternative for copper in the high current cable? Isn't aluminum used in high power transmission lines?

 

[Ingineer]

Phil, is aluminum a viable alternative for copper in the high current cable? Isn't aluminum used in high power transmission lines?

Definitely Not! You are correct that Aluminum is used in power transmission. It is wrapped around a steel core for strength. Aluminum doesn't like flexing and would fail rapidly if used in a non-fixed cable.

Aluminum doesn't have the conductivity of copper, so you need more of it to carry the same amount of current, but it is cheaper than copper. It does have issues with oxidation and termination also, but google is your friend if you'd like to know more.

-Phil

 

[jimcmorr]

Phil, is aluminum a viable alternative for copper in the high current cable? Isn't aluminum used in high power transmission lines?

Definitely Not! You are correct that Aluminum is used in power transmission. It is wrapped around a steel core for strength. Aluminum doesn't like flexing and would fail rapidly if used in a non-fixed cable.

Aluminum doesn't have the conductivity of copper, so you need more of it to carry the same amount of current, but it is cheaper than copper. It does have issues with oxidation and termination also, but google is your friend if you'd like to know more.

-Phil

Thanks for that clarification Phil. I had not thought of aluminum's dislike for flexing.

 

[TangoKilo]

This is also why aluminum cables have been "terminated" (sic) for aircraft use... Too many fires...

 

[Ingineer]

This is also why aluminum cables have been "terminated" (sic) for aircraft use... Too many fires...

Wow, I've never seen or heard about any Aluminum wiring used for avionics. Ditto even for lowly cars. It would be a disaster! WiskeyTangoFoxtrot?!? =)

-Phil

 

[patrick0101]

I plugged EVSE Upgrade on Transport Evolved. (with caveats) The host said it is a great product.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCyQlcAuSa8[/youtube]
It was somewhere in the 2nd half of the show.

 

[TonyWilliams]

at 49:45....