San Francisco Bay Area Quick Chargers Getting them sooner

[Phoenix]

i think the dealership option is best for a start due to the ability to monitor and provide quicker response for repair issues.

now, despite what I said, the QC deployment will be reviewed and in the Vacaville case, it very well could be an exception. keep in mind, its all speculation right now and part of the group's focus is how to determine what is a good place and not a good place. there is a LOT of consensus that this is a good place and Nissan will know this (if they dont already and I suspect they do. the person in charge of the deployment plans is an active reader of this forum and whether she plans to address these issues with us directly here or not, its not like your comments are not known.

Has anyone pointed out to Nissan that the existing Vacaville (defunct) DC location (at the park-and-ride) has an excellent location, already has the infrastructure for a single (or several?) DC's, is adjacent to multiple L2s for "back up", and could conceivably be up and running extremely quickly?

Isn't the main thing holding up the replacement (we are told) is that no one has given Vacaville a replacement (UL approved) DC?

Heck, Nissan could put in their own sleek DCQC if the nozzle is a problem (which I don't think it is). Just a stupid holding pattern amongst various bureaucrats with no one stepping up to assume liability. THIS CAN BE A TRANSITIONAL QC for a defined period of time if someone (Nissan) takes over liability from PG&E or Eaton which supposedly was signing a contract with the city of Vacaville (last we heard).

Ball's in Nissan's court. They have most to gain by having QCs that will sell more LEAFs. Maybe they can get some SF/Oakland/Walnut Creek dealership to sponsor this QC. Sell more LEAFs in Bay Area. Advertise that LEAF can go all the way up to Sacto with a QC for the time being. Until NRG, Blink, etc. puts up the for-profit infrastructure.

 

[OrientExpress]

I agree w/the first point. For ones where installation is 99% certain, there ought to be a list that we can see, so that it's not a case of making promises they can't deliver.

This is another example where I think Nissan's communication could be a lot better.

All in due time Andrew. These things move at their own schedule.

 

[GRA]

I agree w/the first point. For ones where installation is 99% certain, there ought to be a list that we can see, so that it's not a case of making promises they can't deliver.

This is another example where I think Nissan's communication could be a lot better.

All in due time Andrew. These things move at their own schedule.

Actually, they move at Nissan's schedule. And their poor communication with customers has been the cause of much of the prevailing angst and anger, all totally unnecessary if Nissan had been forthright from the start. Apparently, Nissan's corporate culture continues to believe that keeping information close-held when there's no compelling reason to do so is the way to go. How many times do they need to be hit upside the head with a baseball bat, before they get it?

 

[Nubo]

I don't think for one second that somebody will see free charging for a LEAF and miraculously want a GT-R there, and not at their local Nissan dealer.

That wasn't quite my point. My point is, there are LEAF drivers who would stop at Vacaville Nissan for a charge, who might not otherwise consider that dealership for purchase. They'd be stopping to facilitate a trip, not necessarily for "free energy". Some of those LEAF drivers are already in the market for other vehicles. They've now come into your showroom. And will be waiting for 20-30 minutes. All it takes now is a decent salesman. People certainly travel significantly out of their home area to purchase vehicles all the time, so the proximity to their residence is not an insurmountable obstacle to secure a sale. You've got a Nissan customer who's walked through your door because of the QC. They are well-satisfied with the LEAF (most LEAF drivers are). They're pleased with your dealership for the convenience of the QC. They are reasonably well off (most LEAF drivers are). They might be looking for another new vehicle. You have shiny new cars to sell. Seems like an asset.

 

[planet4ever]

Tops of my personal list right now would be:
#1: Gilroy
#2: San Francisco
#3: San Jose
#4: Santa Cruz
Hopefully dealers in all those cities are getting the DC/QCs...

Gilroy is in the right place and does seem important, but they might need some convincing. In my experience they don't seem terribly enthusiastic about the LEAF, and their L2 charger is often blocked. By San Jose I assume you mean Premier Nissan, the one dealer actually in San Jose. They (or at least their service department) are enthusiastic about the LEAF, but they are not close to any freeway -- Almaden Expressway and Capitol Expressway are not exactly inter-city routes. Stevens Creek Nissan in Santa Clara is close to I-280, but they seem rather leery about random people using their electricity. Besides, the Peninsula is already well covered.

Ray

 

[Deleted member 3147]

By San Jose I assume you mean Premier Nissan, the one dealer actually in San Jose. They (or at least their service department) are enthusiastic about the LEAF, but they are not close to any freeway -- Almaden Expressway and Capitol Expressway are not exactly inter-city routes. Stevens Creek Nissan in Santa Clara is close to I-280, but they seem rather leery about random people using their electricity. Besides, the Peninsula is already well covered.

Ray

:?: :?: :?: Premier is about a mile from CA-87 and another couple of miles from CA-85. If you're heading south of San Jose from the Peninsula, CA-85 is a great route (including carpool lanes to go with our stickers).

 

[cwerdna]

By San Jose I assume you mean Premier Nissan, the one dealer actually in San Jose. They (or at least their service department) are enthusiastic about the LEAF, but they are not close to any freeway -- Almaden Expressway and Capitol Expressway are not exactly inter-city routes. Stevens Creek Nissan in Santa Clara is close to I-280, but they seem rather leery about random people using their electricity. Besides, the Peninsula is already well covered.

Ray

:?: :?: :?: Premier is about a mile from CA-87 and another couple of miles from CA-85. If you're heading south of San Jose from the Peninsula, CA-85 is a great route (including carpool lanes to go with our stickers).

Yep, on both of the above highways. And from there, 87 or 85 are decent routes to 280, 101 or 17/880. My parents live very close to all those car dealers on Capitol.

 

[planet4ever]

By San Jose I assume you mean Premier Nissan, the one dealer actually in San Jose. They (or at least their service department) are enthusiastic about the LEAF, but they are not close to any freeway -- Almaden Expressway and Capitol Expressway are not exactly inter-city routes.

:?: :?: :?: Premier is about a mile from CA-87 and another couple of miles from CA-85. If you're heading south of San Jose from the Peninsula, CA-85 is a great route (including carpool lanes to go with our stickers).

Sorry, I never think of 87 as a freeway; more like the downtown and airport parking lot. As for 85, it takes a good 5 minutes or more to get through the traffic signals at the exit onto Almaden, even from northbound 85 due to the no-right-turn sign, and then you get hit with two more very long traffic signals before you get to Capitol. To top it off, you'd better have your nav system directing you, or know the road extremely well, or you are almost sure to go right past the very obscure Capitol exit, and then you will be in a real mess trying to backtrack your way to Nissan. I would estimate that the average non-local driver will lose at least 20 minutes detouring from 85 to Premier Nissan.

Ray

 

[cwerdna]

Sorry, I never think of 87 as a freeway; more like the downtown and airport parking lot. As for 85, it takes a good 5 minutes or more to get through the traffic signals at the exit onto Almaden, even from northbound 85 due to the no-right-turn sign, and then you get hit with two more very long traffic signals before you get to Capitol. To top it off, you'd better have your nav system directing you, or know the road extremely well, or you are almost sure to go right past the very obscure Capitol exit, and then you will be in a real mess trying to backtrack your way to Nissan. I would estimate that the average non-local driver will lose at least 20 minutes detouring from 85 to Premier Nissan.

LOL! For me, 85 and 87 are the two closest highways to me. I don't have any other choices! It's a ~10 minute drive from home just to get onto 85 or maybe 12-13 minutes to get onto 87.

87's traffic isn't THAT terrible if you're not going in the direction of traffic during rush hour. Most times when I take it, it's flowing freely.

Hmmm, as for your 20-minutes assertion, I'm not sure it's that terrible. If someone does it a few times, I think they'll realize that getting on 87 in order to get back on 85 is probably a better way than messing w/getting back on 85 via Almaden.

 

[Ingineer]

This is shot of screen of QC at Nissan Headquarters. I dont read Japanese but pretty sure the default time setting is 15 minutes.

Excellent! This is what I recommend be done to all QC's.

-Phil

 

[TonyWilliams]

In my experience they don't seem terribly enthusiastic about the LEAF, and their L2 charger is often blocked....

You wait until these dealers get their first power bill (with bonus demand charges) and see how often they are miraculously blocked, turned off, or otherwise given the cold shoulder.

Or the litmus test of "did you buy the car here, and we'll turn it on?"

Sadly, this "free" model is ripe with shortcomings, IMHO. Yes, I know everybody wants to believe there is a net benefit to the dealer, but neither I nor many / most of the dealers do. The same is largely true of MOST businesses considered as a potential host for a DC charging station.

It's just reality, no matter how much it would be super neat-o awesome to be otherwise.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Looks like they are partnering with EVgo which means unlikely to be free very long

 

[TonyWilliams]

Looks like they are partnering with EVgo which means unlikely to be free very long

The dealership ones will be the Sumitomo built Nissan branded chargers. NRG/EVgo won't have their hands in this.

Should the dealers provide free charging, expect all the issues I have outlined:


1- Dealers in "out of the way" places that sell few LEAFs are not so keen to fund your transient transportation needs. I recognize that some LEAFers (who have no skin in the game) think it's gunna be great for these dealers, but the dealers know that the only people it would be great for is you.

2- Dealers will be physically turning them off, blocking them, locking them, installing them in inaccessible areas (try and find a SINGLE L2 at a Toyota dealer that sells Rav4... they are hidden in the back to service the car only), not repairing the units when they break, et al. Wait until those dealers who did accept a DC charger get their first couple of power bills!!! It will be nothing but the manager's parking spot after that... to make sure nobody can get access to it.

3- You didn't buy here, you won't charge here.

4- It will dissuade non- government funded / subsidized entities from wanting to place a charger anywhere near these places for hopefully obvious reasons. In other words, outfits that are NOT sucking from the taxpayer's teet that will have to actually pay the bills and can't compete with "free".

Charging a fair fee for the service that meets the market rates alleviates ALL the above concerns.

 

[TEG]

Windows task manager seen tonight on the Blink QC display...

100% CPU usage? I guess playing those HD videos uses a lot of CPU!

 

[timhebb]

If that Blink display were a touchscreen you could really have some fun...

 

[timhebb]

Looks like they are partnering with EVgo which means unlikely to be free very long

The dealership ones will be the Sumitomo built Nissan branded chargers. NRG/EVgo won't have their hands in this.

Should the dealers provide free charging, expect all the issues I have outlined:

1- Dealers in "out of the way" places that sell few LEAFs are not so keen to fund your transient transportation needs. I recognize that some LEAFers (who have no skin in the game) think it's gunna be great for these dealers, but the dealers know that the only people it would be great for is you.

2- Dealers will be physically turning them off, blocking them, locking them, installing them in inaccessible areas (try and find a SINGLE L2 at a Toyota dealer that sells Rav4... they are hidden in the back to service the car only), not repairing the units when they break, et al. Wait until those dealers who did accept a DC charger get their first couple of power bills!!! It will be nothing but the manager's parking spot after that... to make sure nobody can get access to it.

3- You didn't buy here, you won't charge here.

4- It will dissuade non- government funded / subsidized entities from wanting to place a charger anywhere near these places for hopefully obvious reasons. In other words, outfits that are NOT sucking from the taxpayer's teet that will have to actually pay the bills and can't compete with "free".

Charging a fair fee for the service that meets the market rates alleviates ALL the above concerns.

Actually, I suspect many of the doomsday scenario events you predict will come to pass - whenever the free market dictates. Fair fees for service will prevail - when the market decides. But not before.

 

[JeremyW]

Heard from a PG&E representative today that the quick charger to replace the old non-UL one in Vacaville is on its way over from Japan. It should show up in port (which port I don't know) any day now.

Of course, I'll believe it when I see it. :roll:

And when/if it does go in, that will become one busy quick charge location on the weekends.

 

[Phoenix]

Re Vacaville QC: Won't be open to the public unless someone/entity takes over its operation. Apparently, PG&E can't operate charging stations. Any further news on Eaton's contract with Vacaville? Is Eaton going to operate it?

 

[TEG]

More fun stuff seen on the big screen at the Blink QC (this time at Silver Springs Redwood City):

Also the touch panels below said "this charger is unavailable until Monday at 7:00 AM" so, yeah, not much use outside of business hours.

Hopefully / eventually the charge station location maps will show the hours of operation for different locations.

 

[EricBayArea]

FWIW, on another thread it was stated that the Vacaville DC works - confirmed on Plug Share

Also confirmed on Plug Share, the DC at the Concord Hilton also works.