Using a timer to charge??

[nlspace]

1440 Watts (about 2 hp) can cause havoc if not controlled regardless of the OBC capacity.

Why try to find a reason to use a cut-off timer that has such a high risk, likelihood and consequences? What are the benefits that would negate or overwhelm these for you to still support this?

The 12V battery power supply is another weak link that can cause severe damage inside an OBC. An old, weak or worn out, low capacity battery could cause a drop out of the holding current for the main contactors in the HV pack. This would create arcing damage or welding of the precious metal contacts.

 

[Klausstein]

I see that has become a controversial topic. I was only asking because of my newness to owning EVs. I figured out how to set the in car timer, so at this point the original question is moot. Thanks all for the advice. This forum has really helped m navigate the ins and outs if my 1st gen. Leaf.

 

[cornbinder89]

If you really want to step into it, ask about oils, and gear box oil changes!

 

[Klausstein]

If you really want to step into it, ask about oils, and gear box oil changes!

I’ll take pass.

 

[pstarSR]

I see that has become a controversial topic. I was only asking because of my newness to owning EVs. I figured out how to set the in car timer, so at this point the original question is moot. Thanks all for the advice. This forum has really helped m navigate the ins and outs if my 1st gen. Leaf.

its ok dont stress. in essence yes you can do this ( with the cheapo timer ). the start time should be fine to run like this. and your END time, should really be where you want the charge percentage to end. then you dont worry about "cutting" off or anything.

like anything in life you CAN do things some ways and ALSO do things in ways that are NOT recommended. They all work though, and the discussion is more semantics of possibilities of drama and issues now. forums can do this, sadly.

I am a facility engineer/ former solar technician, I make sure buildings and equipment are running for semi conductor fabrication. I would NEVER disconnect a power source from any unit that is actively running current. because I know what can happen. does that mean, I am ( and others ) are being overly cautious?...... not really, just giving the side of discussion needed to make your own determination of risk.

cliff notes -
can you yank your power cord out mid charge - YEA course you can - should you - NO course NOT
can you run a xmas light timer to get good TOU rates - YES course you can - should you - YES OF COURSE YOU SHOULD - just make sure its rated for 15amps minimum

try to play nice with your battery, its storing energy.

 

[cornbinder89]

Why try to find a reason to use a cut-off timer that has such a high risk, likelihood and consequences? What are the benefits that would negate or overwhelm these for you to still support this?

I did not advocate for its use, only said "I don't see a problem" and I still don't. If there was such a problem, I think we'd be seeing a lot more chargers damaged by people who either trip over the cord, plug too much into the 120 volt circuit and tripped a breaker, plug the charger into a switched circuit, etc.
My 1st choice would be the onboard timer, I don't remember any precautions in the manual about not unplugging the trickle charger while charging.
With the power factor correction between the input and main charging, sections it is hard to see how this (remote cut of input) is going to damage anything.
I still and always prefer the onboard timers. I never said it was better or preferred.
I disagree with the "high risk" and "likelihood", if those were true, 20 some years on we would be seeing a lot more chargers "ruined" from power failures of all sorts.
Nothing is 100%, and it could, but failure isn't likely 100% either.

 

[knightmb]

One would hope that Nissan engineers researched all of the use cases including charging with L1/L2 and the house or building losing power. They would have to determine what could possibly be harmed were this to happen and mitigate that to ensure that it is always safe for this case. It's completely unacceptable to lose power only to find afterwards that the charger and/or PDM is bricked.

I've lost power dozens of times over the last decade with both my 2013, 2018, and 2020 currently charging on the L2 at max power. Never bricked any of the electronics. I did have to reset my EVSE every time because it has a safety feature that makes it wait for hours before it will send power back to the EV, but that's about all it does. I would have to agree that Nissan has put some type protection in place or else I've gotten lucky those pile of times...

 

[cornbinder89]

If you walk up to your car, charging at full 27.5 amp (6 Kw) and press the button on the J1772, the 1st thing that happens is the contactor in the EVSE opens. Now may be it also send a signal to "ramp down" the charger, but that contactor opens in the EVSE fairly darn fast. They want those contacts in the plug/receptacle "dead" before you can pull it out.
In most cases there is no other way to shut off the charger before full charge, while charging if not on the timer. If your worried about inductance and opening a circuit, there would have to be more time than there is between when you press the button, and the contactors open.
I still don't see it as a big problem, if I can stop the charge while at full 27.5 amp input and have many times, the 12 amp 120 volt is not going to cause a problem.

 

[pstarSR]

working in the auto crash industry, for 15 years. I have learned that auto makers DO NOT have your best intentions at heart. Never think they do, they want to make money.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

I have 2013 Leaf S that doesn't have a way to set what time to charge it. It is 1/4 the price for me to charge after 10:00PM, and I want to take advantage of that. I do have a charging station I use to charge my 2020 SV+, but I prefer to use 110 on the 2013. The batter only has 4 bars and I am trying to make it last as long as possible.
So, I was thinking about using an outdoor outlet timer like the one pictured to charge my 2013 at night. The idea is: at 10:00 the switch turns on and the already plugged in Leaf starts charging. Would doing this mess up the Leaf charging system? Has anybody done this?

Thanks in advance

I had a 2013 S with Charge/climate package and it most certainly did have a charge timer

 

[nlspace]

@coulomb reported that pressing the trigger, the EVSE contactors stay engaged but that the charge current ramps to zero. Maybe different EVSE respond differently?

Releasing the trigger and charging would resume.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

There is a timer for the 2013 S, but you can’t set a specific time to start and end charging it. I go to bed early so going out at 10:00 PM isn’t realistic.

If it has a timer...then what "can" you set?

 

[Klausstein]

I had a 2013 S with Charge/climate package and it most certainly did have a charge timer

Yeah. I figured it out. lol. I also have a 2020 SV+ and the 2013’s settings were just a bit confusing. The on board timer works great, now that I figured it out. Lol

 

[Klausstein]

If it has a timer...then what "can" you set?

What time to stop charging. I learned from this thread that the car estimates how long to get to 100%, and it starts charging that long before the end time. It works pretty good…now that I understand it.

 

[knightmb]

@coulomb reported that pressing the trigger, the EVSE contactors stay engaged but that the charge current ramps to zero. Maybe different EVSE respond differently?

Releasing the trigger and charging would resume.

I have to agree, with my EVSE, the contactors are very loud (as they were designed I guess in 2013, ) so I know when it's engaged or not. Doing the same thing, just pressing the button on the trigger doesn't release them from the 240V mains, not until I actually pull the connector out. If you watch LeafSpy, the power input drops to 0 when pressing the button and resumes when releasing the button. Not until the connector is pulled out, does the EVSE dis-engage the main power as well as hearing the Leaf contactors dis-engage as well.

During a power outage, the EVSE (mine anyway) remains in an error state when power is restored (even when the power goes out for just a second) and I have to manually reset it via the breakers if I don't want to wait for hours for it to reset on its own. I would guess that the EVSE probably has a capacitor or two to keep some power going in the electronics that when the power is cut to the 240V main, it can probably relay this to the pilot signal to shutdown charging before it finally goes dead itself, just a guess...

 

[cornbinder89]

You may be correct, and I am hearing the car's main contactor. My car is in a small garage, and a clack in that small space, could be from anything.
From the SAE requirement the contactor must be open before the plug exits the receptacle, whether it is when the button is pressed or when one of the pilot pins breaks contact, I don't know.
Any way you look at it, I think we are disagreeing over trivia. I don't think it will kill a charger one way or the other.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

What time to stop charging. I learned from this thread that the car estimates how long to get to 100%, and it starts charging that long before the end time. It works pretty good…now that I understand it.

oh ok. I think I kinda remember that in my 2013. I simply set the time to stop 3-4 hours after plugging in if I didn't want it to charge to full albeit that was rare on my 24's since I was doing the road warrior thing in those days.