Loud reverse braking

Thanks nateads, that would be useful.

The evidence in my case points strongly towards the parking brake. I have been avoiding using the parking brake at all and the noise is absent. I shall try to remember to use the brake when I have parked reversed in so that I'll be driving out forwards and we'll see (or hear!) the result. With the weather as it is currently here (UK) I am reluctant to grovel on my hands and knees to look inside the brakes so the remedy, if there is one, will wait until better weather arrives.

My leaf from 2015 recently has the same problem ( over 40.000 km) Only when reversing i hear continuous squealing. Last days when reversing further i hear clunking noise and feel the brakes gripping.

When driving forwards there is no noise but after jacking up the left rear I feel the rear wheel brake drags.
I removed wheel and brake caliper and pads to get the brake disk/drum off. I could locate the lever that acts the brake shoes and is pulled by the parking brake cable and managed to force it a bit back. The parking brake is drum brake type and now ran without drag. So some how the parking brake pedal does not fully release the cable any more.
For the moment i loosened the brake shoe adjuster 3 clicks and now the left rear wheel does not squeal or clunk when reversing but the other side still does. So luckily the problem is not with the disk brakes or hydraulics.

A bit of a mystery what has happened as there was no rust or signs of water near the rear brake shoes and cable and I never had this since 2015 !

Have to look under the rear seat they say, under a lid should be the cable coming from the parking brake pedal and an equalizer that controls both rear wheels and a return spring.
Problem is that I cannot get the rear seat up. They say it is mounted with two loops that should click out. Don't want to put too much force on it.

Has any one got the rear seat up and looked under this lid for the parking brake cable ?

The return spring may have broken. I haven't personally removed a Leaf rear seat, but I've read that it requires quite a bit of force to get it out...

Orbiter2006 said:

... Problem is that I cannot get the rear seat up. They say it is mounted with two loops that should click out. Don't want to put too much force on it.

Has any one got the rear seat up and looked under this lid for the parking brake cable ?

Click to expand...

The rear seat on my 2015 was very difficult to remove. Here's a post I made on that:

Nubo said:

Just removed the rear seat cushion in my 2015, to install a seat cover.

What a pain!!

There are several problems.

1 - Wheras the 2012 rear seat had some rigidity, the 2015 "rear cushion" has no real frame strength.
2 - The clips hold with tremendous force.
3 - the metal loops are wrapped with cloth adhesive tape. This may ruin whatever chance the clip had of releasing.
4 - there is no way to get any kind of tool involved to press in on the tabs that hold the clips in place

It's difficult to remove without damaging the clips, the holes they fit into, or the seat itself.

Here's a picture of the underside of the seat. The receiving clip is still attached to the metal loop It just wouldn't let go. Now that it's exposed I can push in the tabs to remove it.

Here you can see the frame hole where the clip is supposed to reside. You can see the hole is distorted a bit. That's how hard I had to pull to get a release. Next to the hole is the clip from the passenger side, which finally did let go of the metal loop after some wrasslin'.

There's no way to get at the clips to make them release. On the driver's side I was able to get the thing to pop out by grabbing both the front of the seat directly in front of the clip, and also the rear of the seat and pulling up from both ends finally got it. It took a LOT of force. I'm probably going to have to bend the cushion back into shape a bit and also have to tap that hole back into shape.

On the passenger side I finally got it out by kneeling outside the car, snaking my arm along the top of that ridge, wrapping my hand around where the clip was and then lever-ing it out.

Were I to try this again I think I'd tie a rope into a noose, get it fished around the clip, cinch it down and the pull up with that from the front side of the seat. This would concentrate the force right at the clip interface. There just isn't enough strength in the seat itself to transmit force effectively.

Dammit Nissan, why did you make it so hard? People do want to put on seat covers occasionally!

Click to expand...

Since Photobucket has since decided to be assholes, here are the unmolested images

What about one of those fork-like clip release tools? It might accomplish the same thing as the rope noose.

LeftieBiker said:

What about one of those fork-like clip release tools? It might accomplish the same thing as the rope noose.

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I found it too tight with too much stuff in the way and I was flying blind. Maybe by looking at the pics someone can devise a tool and/or approach to successfully disengage the clips.

Thanks Nubo for your pictures ! Knowing where to pull now I could pull up the seat.

//home.hccnet.nl/a.van.belle/LEAF/Parking%20Brake%20Equalizer%20cover.jpg
Removed the "bare metal" cover that is under the seat and there is the parking brake cable with equalizer to both cables running to the rear brake drums !

//home.hccnet.nl/a.van.belle/LEAF/Parking%20brake%20equalizer%20parked.jpg

The cables from the rear showed grease and ran smoothly when actuating the brake pedal. Only the inner cable running to the front (to the brake pedal) was not greased.

What surprised me is that the return spring is very weak, you can lift it with only one finger.
I managed to mount the spring so that it pulls a bit stronger.
//home.hccnet.nl/a.van.belle/LEAF/More%20tension%20from%20return%20spring.jpg

Not sure if this helps, have to try for a couple of days.

The parking brake not releasing might be a weak spot in this leaf version. When my car was new I occasionally had a "spring noise" coming from behind when i drove about 50 meters after having used the parking brake. Now I think this noise always might have been this return spring acting too late.
After 5 years of use I don't hear this noise anymore, instead the parking brake does not fully release.

Interesting...I had no problems with the electric parking brake on 2011, but pedal-operated parking brake on 2015 required frequent adjustment and I sometimes felt something slipping (assumed it was cable stretch or pedal ratchet mechanism). I also heard spring noise once in a while. I have had no problems with the electric parking brake on 2019 and it is nice to have the extra driver foot space (where pedal was on 2015).

I too have had no issues with my electric parking brake releasing on my 2011. I use it all the time.

Following advice from another Leaf owner I drove along our road for about a quarter of a mile with the parking brake partly applied. Next time I parked I used the parking brake and when I reversed... blessed silence!
Time will tell how long this remedy works for and I shall report accordingly.

motco said:

Following advice from another Leaf owner I drove along our road for about a quarter of a mile with the parking brake partly applied. Next time I parked I used the parking brake and when I reversed... blessed silence!
Time will tell how long this remedy works for and I shall report accordingly.

Click to expand...

You should not be applying brakes for long distances because you don't know how hot the brakes will get.

There is no such thing as silent brakes in the real world. When the car sits for a few days, and it rains, the rotors will make some noise until you wear off the coating of rust that got on them.... That is normal

Are the brakes ok when you go forward? If yes, then you are fine. My brakes make some rubbing sound and some squeak when I go in reverse from my driveway every day... That is normal due to the direction of the wheels turning and the orientation of the brake pads.

Do not make this an area that requires a repair.....

powersurge said:

motco said:

Following advice from another Leaf owner I drove along our road for about a quarter of a mile with the parking brake partly applied. Next time I parked I used the parking brake and when I reversed... blessed silence!
Time will tell how long this remedy works for and I shall report accordingly.

Click to expand...

You should not be applying brakes for long distances because you don't know how hot the brakes will get.

There is no such thing as silent brakes in the real world. When the car sits for a few days, and it rains, the rotors will make some noise until you wear off the coating of rust that got on them.... That is normal

Are the brakes ok when you go forward? If yes, then you are fine. My brakes make some rubbing sound and some squeak when I go in reverse from my driveway every day... That is normal due to the direction of the wheels turning and the orientation of the brake pads.

Do not make this an area that requires a repair.....

Click to expand...

Powersurge, thank you, I appreciate your reply and quite agree that the brakes should not be abused. The parking brake was on for a quarter mile only, only gently as well, and as it was a mere 4ºC here at the time, there was no danger that the drums (it is definitely the parking brake drums not the service brakes - discs/rotors) that were binding. This type of parking brake is used extensively on BMW cars in the past (I don't know about currently) and they suffer from the fact that the linings never make contact with a rotating drum in use. In a cool damp climate (England) rust develops on the drums, and the linings absorb moisture. These conspire to create a condition where the trailing shoe digs in when the car is reversed after an extended period of being stationary because it becomes a leading shoe when the wheel is revolving against its normal direction. I have a Spartanburg built BMW Z3 which does the same thing. Quite why the leading shoe in forward motion does not behave in the same manner is a mystery though. Once the rust has been scuffed off the drum and the shoe stops rubbing, the brake ceases its complaining noises. I suspect that it does the same thing in forward motion but as the car would commonly drive away faster forwards that in reverse, the squealing passes rapidly and un-noticed. For some time I was relying on the parking pawl in the transmission (in PARK) to hold the car on my drive, and there was no instance of reverse brake squeal. Only when the car was returned to the Nissan dealer for a recall to replace the earthing brackets on the battery did the matter raise its head again as they used the parking brake. It can bind so strongly that reversing becomes a hazardous business. If the binding were to suddenly release then the extra power applied could cause uncontrolled acceleration in the confines of a parking area. The awful noise is a side issue but can alarm unwary pedestrians!

Another member (on this or another forum) had used the 'drive with the brake lightly applied' technique to good effect so I though I would do the same. I drove a further four miles after releasing the brake and parked in a supermarket car park and felt all four brakes with my bare fingers. No appreciable heat at all in any of them so no binding had occurred in that short journey, and any overheating must have been very minor indeed or some warmth would have remained. My son, who lives in Australia leaves an Audi RS4 here for his frequent trips home. The massive floating rotor brakes on that car turn red with rust in a couple of weeks, but a short drive with a light pressure on the pedal rubs the rust off very effectively.

Again, I am grateful for your cautionary advice and agree that running with the brake on hard and/or for too long would risk de-bonding the friction material. Apologies for the long reply but my thought processes and practical experience over a million miles of driving have not been in vain!

motco said:

Following advice from another Leaf owner I drove along our road for about a quarter of a mile with the parking brake partly applied. Next time I parked I used the parking brake and when I reversed... blessed silence!
Time will tell how long this remedy works for and I shall report accordingly.

Click to expand...

1/4 mile is surely not enough.
That was good for only about two weeks of (complete) silence for me.
Last week I did 2-3 km in my subdivision using only the Pbrake at intersections
Wheelhubs felt only just above lukewarm.
It's a full drum brake setup in there, just mechanically operated instead of hydraulically. It can take lots 'o heat.
Let's see if this makes a better long term difference. That squealing first thing in the morning is not how I like to wake up.

Virtuallydead said:

motco said:

Following advice from another Leaf owner I drove along our road for about a quarter of a mile with the parking brake partly applied. Next time I parked I used the parking brake and when I reversed... blessed silence!
Time will tell how long this remedy works for and I shall report accordingly.

Click to expand...

1/4 mile is surely not enough.
That was good for only about two weeks of (complete) silence for me.
Last week I did 2-3 km in my subdivision using only the Pbrake at intersections
Wheelhubs felt only just above lukewarm.
It's a full drum brake setup in there, just mechanically operated instead of hydraulically. It can take lots 'o heat.
Let's see if this makes a better long term difference. That squealing first thing in the morning is not how I like to wake up.

Click to expand...

You're right VirtuallyDead, it would not be enough if drying out the linings was the object, but I wanted try simply scuffing the rust off to see whether that would sort the problem. If it proves to be temporary only, then I'll try increasingly longer runs. There's miles of country lanes around here where I can drive - stop and check the temperature - run -stop again etc. A non-contact IR thermometer will help.

Thanks to all who joined the discussion, now I know it is not an isolated case !

The design of this drum brake is like an "overrun" brake, it will "bite" when the car rolls backwards and should release when driving forwards.
But the return springs under the rear seat and in both brake drums should fully retract the brake shoes so there is no drag that could shorten drive range. Even if the brake shoe lining is expanded by moisture.

Rust inside the brake drum may form in wet climates after a few weeks of no use but this should be easily removed within a few revolutions of the wheel. Driving for more than say 10 meter with the parking brake on will wear out the brake shoe lining if done frequently.

The real problem is the way the brake shoes of this drum brake are kept in their place, They are mounted floating so they automatically center in the drum. But to keep them floating "in place" they are forced to the backing plate with springs. Here there is metal to metal contact between brake shoe and backing plate. When new there is paint keeping these contact surfaces from rusting but after a number of years rust will take over and the brake shoes will need more force to fully retract. More than the return springs offer.

So a temporary measure would be to scrape these contact surfaces clean by acting the parking brake pedal fully multiple times when the car is parked.
Greasing these contact surfaces is tricky as grease can run off in summer and foul up your drum and brake shoes.
Best option is to add stainless steel shims between brake shoes and backing plate.
Will look into this next weekend if weather permits and take some photos.

motco said:

Following advice from another Leaf owner I drove along our road for about a quarter of a mile with the parking brake partly applied. Next time I parked I used the parking brake and when I reversed... blessed silence!
Time will tell how long this remedy works for and I shall report accordingly.

Click to expand...

This is interesting. But in my case I can modulate the squeaking with brake pedal pressure so I'm not sure how that would translate to parking-brake pad squeal. Sounds worth a try though; I can't imagine destroying the linings with a bit of mild braking.

(...am I the only one that is annoyed by the spelling in the thread title??? )

Nope. Very common mistake, though.

Nubo said:

motco said:

Following advice from another Leaf owner I drove along our road for about a quarter of a mile with the parking brake partly applied. Next time I parked I used the parking brake and when I reversed... blessed silence!
Time will tell how long this remedy works for and I shall report accordingly.

Click to expand...

This is interesting. But in my case I can modulate the squeaking with brake pedal pressure so I'm not sure how that would translate to parking-brake pad squeal. Sounds worth a try though; I can't imagine destroying the linings with a bit of mild braking.

Click to expand...

Nubo, I suspect we are barking up different trees! The (service) brakes do 'grunt' a bit when almost stopped and that also seems to be a feature of the Leaf. We're referring to a nasty squealing noise and resistance to progress in reverse after parking with the foot-operated parking brake. The pedal is released, reverse selected, and the car is reluctant to move without accelerator pressure (when it usually creeps like a normal torque converter auto), and yet after a normal journey reversing is back to normal as long as the parking brake remains unused.