TonyWilliams
Well-known member
Nubo said:
They don't own the stations, and I doubt they would want to own any of the Blink ones!!! The best hope is a swap out of the crap Blink equipment for something reliable.
ECOtality News 8/12/13 - DOE Stops payments
- Thread starter Randy
- Start date
Help Support My Nissan Leaf Forum:
They don't own the stations, and I doubt they would want to own any of the Blink ones!!! The best hope is a swap out of the crap Blink equipment for something reliable.
LEAFfan
Well-known member
This morning after charging, I noticed the plastic cap from the car's top right pin J connector missing. The Blink EVSE may have melted it. So I called ECOtality and they said someone would call me back within 48 hours. A few minutes later Michael Martin called and said he could be here in about 30-40 minutes to install a new nozzle and cord. He arrived in less than 30 minutes and quickly replaced the old nozzle and cord. Absolutely Amazing service! Tomorrow morning I'll get a temp reading. On the 2013, to get the highest reading, take the temp right after a 45-60 min. charge because after that the car cuts the amps.
^ Looking to show responsiveness in a last ditch effort to keep the money flowing?
LEAFfan
Well-known member
mwalsh said:
Idk, but I'm very much appreciative.
Randy
Well-known member
drees said:
More features = more issues...
Just put in a basic Clipper Creek CS-40 or a CS-100 if you can swing it and let people grab some electrons for free. No point of sale hardware, no network fees, no 7% revenue slurp, and no down time...
TonyWilliams
Well-known member
drees said:
If I had the company, I'd probably swap in an OpenEVSE guts. Make them dumb and simple with a relatively low cost fix.
To generate income, and because the current Rema ones are garbage, I think I'd sell cords like they do in Europe. Then, add a Mennekes receptacle on the unit, which now has no cable to be vandalized or burn a pin on a car. Two problems fixed.
Now, I sell Mennekes to J1772 cables and give away the L2 charging service. Freeloaders won't ever show up because they need a cable that costs $199.99. Folks that buy the cable aren't cheapskates and have virtually free reign of the charging locations. The Mennekes adaptor is encrypted with the owners billing for future use.
If I sell 1000 of these cable sets, that's $199,990 in gross receipts, and $100,000 in profit. More than Blink pulled in, and all the units work.
When I sell 10,000 cable sets, almost $2 million in gross receipts!!! After a few years, I add pay by the minute/kWh, with a system paid for with the revenue from selling cables. No cards to swipe, because every time a person plugs in, the billing is already known.
I celebrate every time a Just-Drive-The-Prius(TM) person complains that it's "too expensive", and realize that is just one less freeloader blocking a spot for paying customers.
All the DC chargers, I would just replace, and again they would be dumb chargers.
Deleted member 8423
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2013
- Messages
- 250
No revenue stream, no chance to make back cash on the charger install, no incentive to install more chargers.Randy said:
TomT
Well-known member
Yep, we have to get over this mindset that charging should be free or nearly so! It is completely unsustainable!
ITestStuff said:
The mindset isn't so much that charging should be free, it is that it should be less expensive than former means of transportation.
If driving my Volt 40 miles costs 1 gallon of gas and driving my Volt 40 miles on electricity costs 13kWh of electricity (4 hours of charging), then charging needs to cost less than 1 gallon of gas. That comes to just under $1/hour and I'm actually cool with paying $1/hour.
But NOT $2 for 1.01 hours, or $1 for 20 minutes.
For the Leaf, where the need could be more important than the cost and with the 6.6kW charger a bit more would certainly seem reasonable, but $2/hour with full hour charges for going over by a little and you alienate your customers real fast.
I always predicted the Blink/Chargepoint model as I've seen it (fast food restaurants, really? I am never even there for a full hour) was unsustainable, except where the retailer is willing to bear the cost. I charged at a Blink once at 5 Guys burgers and felt ripped off. I've charged at the free ChargePoint at Half Price Books a couple of times.
Of course the problem for me now with two Blinks in the garage is going to be service, which they have needed every few months. But, they were ~$300 each.
If driving my Volt 40 miles costs 1 gallon of gas and driving my Volt 40 miles on electricity costs 13kWh of electricity (4 hours of charging), then charging needs to cost less than 1 gallon of gas. That comes to just under $1/hour and I'm actually cool with paying $1/hour.
But NOT $2 for 1.01 hours, or $1 for 20 minutes.
For the Leaf, where the need could be more important than the cost and with the 6.6kW charger a bit more would certainly seem reasonable, but $2/hour with full hour charges for going over by a little and you alienate your customers real fast.
I always predicted the Blink/Chargepoint model as I've seen it (fast food restaurants, really? I am never even there for a full hour) was unsustainable, except where the retailer is willing to bear the cost. I charged at a Blink once at 5 Guys burgers and felt ripped off. I've charged at the free ChargePoint at Half Price Books a couple of times.
Of course the problem for me now with two Blinks in the garage is going to be service, which they have needed every few months. But, they were ~$300 each.
TonyWilliams
Well-known member
Cheezmo said:
There's no connection between the price to Just-Drive-The-Prius(TM) and electricity for an EV. They aren't indexed in some way. The models are vastly different (gas stations make most of their money selling snacks). Obviously, Blink / ChargePoint, et al, are not in the snack business. So, virtually all the revenue to support the business comes from the tax payer or you. If neither will pay, we know what will happen to the infrastructure. $1 or $2 per hour probably isn't sustainable on the business side, either, to be honest. They are also competing against locations that are >>> free <<< and people who expect near free.
Electricity will no doubt remain somewhat stable in price in the coming years, while gasoline could do just about anything. Future consumers aren't going to do all the back-of-the-napkin calculations to determine which car might be cheaper to drive that day, and they aren't likely to have the luxury of multiple cars to chose which one might save them a dollar. The whole thinking process just isn't the mass consumer audience.
If it's too expensive, seriously, don't use it. Drive the oil car. It will leave charging locations for everybody who wants and needs a charge and who wants to support EVs and the EV infrastructure. I think I'll go have a Coke now... oh, crap, it's $1, when I can get case from Costco for 18 cents each. What to do?
TonyWilliams said:
That is exactly what is happening. People aren't using it.
I've had a Leaf for over year and paid way to much for an evGo membership in order to support the infrastructure, but DC fast charging has a been awesome and allowed me to go all over the metroplex all electric. No way I got my moneys worth of electricity, but those stations are extremely useful and I haven't minded paying the premium for it to have it available when needed.
The blink 240V charging stations are all but worthless to me so I have no interest in paying extra to support that infrastructure. I think there is one time I used one with the Leaf while eating at McDonalds in order to get the extra range I needed on that trip to get to the McDonalds, even then I sat in the car for 30 minutes after eating to make sure I picked up the needed range. An evGo station opened in that area a few weeks later so no way I would waste that time at a Blink again.
6.6kW charging might tip the scale in the future but for me right now there is just never a time it makes sense to use a Blink or ChargePoint 240V station unless it is under $1. I completely understand that they lose money at that rate, and therefore may just as well go away as far as I'm concerned.
TomT
Well-known member
I believe that anything less than 10 Kw simply is too restrictive to every make it to critical mass...
Cheezmo said:
evnow
Well-known member
L2s only make sense as a service provided by the business at which it is installed. They can't generate any kind of ROI - except may be in apartments & work places.
With all this being said.. I just pre-ordered a few weeks back the Blink HQ home charger... They told me this will be shipped out Aug-22nd..
Thoughts do you think I should canx? If they go bankrupt, there would be no warranty! correct?
Thanks for all the great info.. this is definitely informative and a little sad.
H
Thoughts do you think I should canx? If they go bankrupt, there would be no warranty! correct?
Thanks for all the great info.. this is definitely informative and a little sad.
H
TonyWilliams
Well-known member
kidkenpo said:
Did you pay with a credit card that you can get your money back with a dispute?
I personally would never buy a Blink anything, and I would recommend getting your order cancelled NOW. If you want that same charger, buy the Bosch or Delta twin to it.
Tony
Thank you for the quick reply, I am new to the EV world Leaf 2013, and saw the prices go down on chargers, Since i use the BLink stations. I thought that it would be smart to use them..
Now all the news makes me nervous.. they did not charge my card (since unit did not ship) stated the sales person today.. but they are looking to still ship as promised.
I emailed my concerns, they skirted the issues, when I mentioned bankrupt and warranty and said.. we are not delayed and you will be getting your charger.
Sounds like I should tell them to Keep it and canx..
Thank you for the quick reply, I am new to the EV world Leaf 2013, and saw the prices go down on chargers, Since i use the BLink stations. I thought that it would be smart to use them..
Now all the news makes me nervous.. they did not charge my card (since unit did not ship) stated the sales person today.. but they are looking to still ship as promised.
I emailed my concerns, they skirted the issues, when I mentioned bankrupt and warranty and said.. we are not delayed and you will be getting your charger.
Sounds like I should tell them to Keep it and canx..
planet4ever
Well-known member
As has been said by a number of people in a variety of ways, that is NOT the correct mindset. For gasoline vehicles all fuel is purchased at a filling station. For electric vehicles, it is expected that most fuel will be purchased at home. If you don't have any way to charge at home you shouldn't have an EV. Stopping to charge an EV on the road should be thought of as more like calling an emergency road service company asking them to bring you some gas. That will always be far more expensive than buying gas at a filling station.Cheezmo said:
If the price of using public charging stations bothers you, figure your total monthly cost of electricity for the car, including what you pay at home. If that total is more than the total you would pay to travel the same number of miles in an ICE, then you can start complaining, or better yet, start thinking about why you are using public stations so much.
Ray
