2018 Nissan Leaf - Really Poor Range

[coldtoez]

The GOM in the 2018+ cars has improved, but it will still be too optimistic if the last stretch of your commute uses much less energy then the average for the trip.

One thing I haven't mentioned is the GOM always predicts an expected 223km to 240km, depending on starting temperature. However, I get much less than that. Vehicle is garage kept, and the garage is attached to the house, so it is always at least 10c in the garage.

 

[cwerdna]

Please answer https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=275421#p275421 here as best you can. Will save on back/forth time.

 

[coldtoez]

You could also try ruling out the climate control system entirely. I've been wearing a heavy coat, ski mittens, and covering my legs with a multi-layer camping blanket rather than using the heat. It's mostly just an efficiency game (and it's quite comfortable). I use the heater if anyone else is in the car.

If range is still very poor with climate control off (some reduction due to temperature alone is expected), I would jack up each wheel (have the car on and in N to check the fronts...block the wheels on the ground well) to make sure each wheel is rotating freely and there are no dragging brakes, bunged bearings, etc.

Good idea about the climate control, and it wouldn't be a hardship as the weather isn't that cold here.

 

[HerdingElectrons]

The mileage your guess-o-meter shows after a charge is completely different than real world mileage. Mine routinely shows over 140miles available after a charge, but the reality is that I'm getting less than 100 in cold weather. The guess-o-meter is essentially worthless.

I have the GOM as well as the dash SOC & LeafSpy Pro running in real time on my tablet. For me once you add 10-14% to the dash readings like Dave says all the indicators track nearly the same suffice to say I principally use Leaf Spy to periodically check SOH

 

[HerdingElectrons]

The GOM in the 2018+ cars has improved, but it will still be too optimistic if the last stretch of your commute uses much less energy then the average for the trip.

One thing I haven't mentioned is the GOM always predicts an expected 223km to 240km, depending on starting temperature. However, I get much less than that. Vehicle is garage kept, and the garage is attached to the house, so it is always at least 10c in the garage.

I'm ASSUMING that a sagging cell is dropping voltage which is why your range is dropping so low so fast.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

The GOM in the 2018+ cars has improved, but it will still be too optimistic if the last stretch of your commute uses much less energy then the average for the trip.

One thing I haven't mentioned is the GOM always predicts an expected 223km to 240km, depending on starting temperature. However, I get much less than that. Vehicle is garage kept, and the garage is attached to the house, so it is always at least 10c in the garage.

Yeah, another reason LEAF Spy works better. You customize your range settings. Sounds complicated but really isn't. I set mine based on miles/kwh and LEAF Spy calculates range based on remaining charge. If you u wrong, adjust to correct. You will find that you can predict your performance with relative accuracy especially on often repeated routes like work commutes.

The GOM however has two major problems;

1) Uses recent driving history as a guide to calculating range. So you need to examine the last several miles to your house. If its downhill, expected a bloated GOM. If its significantly slower than most of the commute; expect a bloated GOM.

2) It creates a hidden reserve. This is why I recommended adding 10% to your range to the bottom of the pack. In my 2019, the GOM and LEAF Spy reading matches at roughly 86% SOC.,, from there, the GOM starts building a hidden reserve.

GOM/LS
80/81.8
73/75.8
64/68.1
57/62.0
50/55.8
24/35.8

As you can see, the GOM is hiding a LOT of range. This will throw anyone off. But LEAF Spy you set the range based on how you drive. So on a round trip work commute; you will see pretty large variances and it will be due to unusual traffic or weather or both. So you simply adjust LEAF Spy to the "drive of the day" and you are good.

One planning tip; You are deciding to take a drive of 226 miles and need to figure out what you need to hit on the miles/kwh meter to make it. LEAF Spy says 4.0. So you take off and find you picked one of the WORST days for the trip. Its a monsoon, pouring rain for most of the first 132 miles of the trip. Despite your best efforts; you are only averaging 3.9 miles/kwh. GOM says you have enough, LEAF Spy says you don't. Who do you believe?

Well, I did exactly this yesterday driving the 101 loop and as you likely know, the charging options are few and far between so I decided to hit 4 different level 2 stations. Mostly to evaluate their usefulness on a trip (access to amenities, things to kill time with, etc.) but also to gain the 8 kwh I needed to safely make the trip (yes, the stops added almost 20 miles to the route) So I made 4 charging stops, all 20 minutes give or take before my "real" stop at the DC in Port Angeles.

 

[alozzy]

I'm careful to turn the AC off, unless the windows are fogged up. I usually run the cabin temp at 19c to 20c, and the fan no higher than the third notch.

Agree with your assessment, your range does seem to be rather low. I would suggest you purchase a OBD2 dongle and LeafSpy Pro to see if there are any problematic individual cells in the pack. Alternatively, perhaps the diagnostic test the dealer claims to have made will have a chart of the cell voltages (doubtful).

Thanks - great idea. I just ordered the dongle, should be here on the weekend. I'm very interested in seeing what it has to say.

I just noticed that this website automatically injected a link to a specific ODB2 dongle, I wanted to be clear that I don't own that device, nor endorse it. I hope you didn't buy that one, thinking that I was making a specific recommendation. I don't like this keyword substitution practice, it's definitely misleading.

 

[LeftieBiker]

The dongle in my signature seems to be universal and reliable.

 

[coldtoez]

Alrighty folks - I haven't forgotten about this. Sorry to bring this old thread out of mothballs, but I appreciate all the responses I received, and I didn't want to lose all that information. Thank you to everyone who has offered suggestions!

So - I got Leaf Spy Pro and a dongle, and I've been keeping track to my heart's content and trying to improve my range. My wife rolls her eyes as I get my phone out at the start of each drive, but I appreciate all the detail LeafSpy provides.

However - consistently the overall range isn't getting any better, even in the summer (I did get better range in the summer, but not that much better).

Using the "Charge" time frame setting (stats from the last charge) on LeafSpy Pro, I can see that on an average bit of driving between home and work, I get a solid 6.5 km/kwh (some times more). I do drive up a hill to get to work, and up a hill to get home, but I'm getting the 6.5km/kwh average despite that. Based on a 40Kwh battery, I should be in excess of the 240km range. In fact, I should be getting close to 260km! (But I'm getting closer t

I've added air to the tires (thank you), but I can't stomach the idea of going all the way to 40psi or above - I've stopped at 38psi.

I appreciated Daveinolywa who showed how the GOM and LeafSpy differed, like the GOM was building a secret reserve. I've seen the opposite - the GOM is always significantly higher than Leafspy Pro, unless I'm averaging over 7.17 km/Kwh.

But - the one thing I just spotted on LeafSpy Pro was that after a 100% charge (97.9% SOC on LeafSpy, 454 GIDs), my remaining power is 35kWh (12.5% reduction from the 40kw/h advertised). I could understand being down app 5% (since we can't use 5% of the battery capacity, right?), but 12.5% is excessive. This seems to be a smoking gun, but I wanted to make sure this wasn't the norm.

What I don't understand is how the GoM is completely oblivious to the lowered battery capacity.

So - my two questions for this post are - is seeing 35kwh correct when the car is fully charged and how do I use LeafSpy Pro to identify a bad cell? Because I've had it into the shop three times because the range hasn't seemed right, if I take it a fourth time I do want the thing fixed.

 

[DougWantsALeaf]

I believe 35-36kWh is the usable battery on the 40 Leaf. Just like 56kWh is the usable in the 62 Leaf Plus.

I would expect full to turtle at 6.5 km/kWh to give you about 230 KM range. You do need to keep about 7 to get advertised range with a new battery.

I just ran a test today at 90 km/h on my Plus in Chicago (it was vetting against a European test, hence why I put the car in metric). The overall average shows 80 only because I had to wait for lights at the turn around for the loop. Its about 7.5 km/kWh so right in line for a medium speed test.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1QOzJgbeX2yFbOgnN89w13S4k7ZsqSRFq/view?usp=drivesdk

 

[lkkms2]

Schedule the charging to end right before you plan to leave (helps warm the battery).

Then also prewarm the car inside while plugged in before driving in the cold.

 

[jlv]

I've added air to the tires (thank you), but I can't stomach the idea of going all the way to 40psi or above - I've stopped at 38psi.

Really go to 42-44psi. It is within the rating of the tire. This will help improve your efficiency.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Alrighty folks - I haven't forgotten about this. Sorry to bring this old thread out of mothballs, but I appreciate all the responses I received, and I didn't want to lose all that information. Thank you to everyone who has offered suggestions!

So - I got Leaf Spy Pro and a dongle, and I've been keeping track to my heart's content and trying to improve my range. My wife rolls her eyes as I get my phone out at the start of each drive, but I appreciate all the detail LeafSpy provides.

However - consistently the overall range isn't getting any better, even in the summer (I did get better range in the summer, but not that much better).

Using the "Charge" time frame setting (stats from the last charge) on LeafSpy Pro, I can see that on an average bit of driving between home and work, I get a solid 6.5 km/kwh (some times more). I do drive up a hill to get to work, and up a hill to get home, but I'm getting the 6.5km/kwh average despite that. Based on a 40Kwh battery, I should be in excess of the 240km range. In fact, I should be getting close to 260km! (But I'm getting closer t

I've added air to the tires (thank you), but I can't stomach the idea of going all the way to 40psi or above - I've stopped at 38psi.

I appreciated Daveinolywa who showed how the GOM and LeafSpy differed, like the GOM was building a secret reserve. I've seen the opposite - the GOM is always significantly higher than Leafspy Pro, unless I'm averaging over 7.17 km/Kwh.

But - the one thing I just spotted on LeafSpy Pro was that after a 100% charge (97.9% SOC on LeafSpy, 454 GIDs), my remaining power is 35kWh (12.5% reduction from the 40kw/h advertised). I could understand being down app 5% (since we can't use 5% of the battery capacity, right?), but 12.5% is excessive. This seems to be a smoking gun, but I wanted to make sure this wasn't the norm.

What I don't understand is how the GoM is completely oblivious to the lowered battery capacity.

So - my two questions for this post are - is seeing 35kwh correct when the car is fully charged and how do I use LeafSpy Pro to identify a bad cell? Because I've had it into the shop three times because the range hasn't seemed right, if I take it a fourth time I do want the thing fixed.

First off; your 40 kwh pack NEVER showed 40 kwh available in LEAF Spy simply because the pack like ALL EV packs has both the very top and the very bottom that is not accessible.

2nd off; LEAF Spy calculates kwh available based on the GID value. Default is 77.5 wh/ GID I believe and that is what I found to be the most accurate as has others. So you will want to check that.

Thirdly; The GOM varies based on recent driving history. Your statement that you drive up a hill both going to and coming home from work is nonsensical.

4thly; what are your qualifications as a tire expert. Some thoughts on tire pressure

https://daveinolywa.blogspot.com/2020/11/to-pump-or-not-to-pump.html

Fiftly; You say you never saw the GOM lower than LEAF Spy which only means you didn't go low enough. As mentioned, the hidden reserve doesn't exist at full charge. It grows as the SOC drops. What you are missing is the range at the bottom of the pack. Guessing you never go below what? 20% SOC? For more on that

https://daveinolywa.blogspot.com/2020/06/e-plus-summer-range-test.html

So we use your math; 4 miles/kwh and 35 kwh to use. Lets keep 2 kwh in reserve so you have 132 miles or over 200 km of range with plenty to spare.

Since you have LEAF Spy now, you should post screenshots of what you got so we can see

 

[LeftieBiker]

I assume that they are two different hills, with a downhill as well each way.

 

[DougWantsALeaf]

You could lower the Leaf.

https://shop.redline360.com/products/h-r-lowering-springs-nissan-leaf-sport-2018-2019-28685-1?variant=31631511978064

 

[ChrisLeaf2018]

Hi coldtoez,

You probably have at least 1 pair of defective cells which is what happened to me. A pack of 2 cells is considered defective when the difference between the min & max is over 100mV on LeafSpy pro.

Take an appointment with your dealership and make sure to do the test drive yourself with a technician on a cold day. I recommend bringing the car charged at 40% max.

Let me know if it works

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Hi coldtoez,

You probably have at least 1 pair of defective cells which is what happened to me. A pack of 2 cells is considered defective when the difference between the min & max is over 100mV on LeafSpy pro.

Take an appointment with your dealership and make sure to do the test drive yourself with a technician on a cold day. I recommend bringing the car charged at 40% max.

Let me know if it works

mV bad depends on SOC and load. Best bet; charge to 75% SOC, let it sit a bit and then check. Delta should be no more than 50 mV (which is kinda bad) and the norm is 10-30 mV