Replaced my LEAF 12v battery after 4 years

[powersurge]

Went to dealer and they checked battery before selling me the new one and they said I didn't need one. Battery Health good, CCA 323. Only issue they saw was 12.38 v reading.

Car is 4 years old. 50K miles. New traction battery 1 month ago. Morning of the check it finished 100% at 6;30. I them drove it to dealer 10 miles away at 1 PM. Radio and driver seat heat on low were on.

There suggestion was to check again in 3 months. Any thoughts?

You never provided much information on why you thought you needed a new 12V battery :?:
Why do you think you need one :?:
Did you discuss that in another topic :?:

I would be more confident in the dealer if their battery test gave you an estimate of 12V capacity rather than CCA.
But possible the 12V is OK.

The only reason I was going to replace the battery was because the car was 4 years old. I've had no issues. Here's the printout if it helps any.

Here are a few state of charge charts I found.

http://www.mmbalmainauto.com.au/PDF/State_of_charge_12_volt_batteries.pdf

http://modernsurvivalblog.com/alternative-energy/battery-state-of-charge-chart/

For the printout you got to be valid, the battery needed to be JUST fully charged. The battery may have been tested as it was in the car, which may have been less than 100% charged. Just by looking at those numbers, it can only tell you the state of strength (at that moment) of the battery, not what the total potential of the battery is. (e.g., It may have been75-95% charged. )

Remember that any business wants to sell, and that they will offer you that new "something" before it is necessary. In the case of a battery, "needing to change" a battery may be one or two years down the line. That is why the load meter is so valuable - it can tell you that NOW "is time to change the battery".

In the future, I suggest that you get a charger, and charge it completely. Then do a load test with the cheap meter I showed earlier. First get a voltage reading, and then do a load test to see if the battery can tolerate the load without "crapping out" (my technical term).

 

[RegGuheert]

In the future, I suggest that you get a charger, and charge it completely.

Good advice! Unfortunately, the forum software links to EVSEs for sale at Amazon when it encounters the word "charger". I will instead highly recommend the BatteryMinder 1500 to do the job.

 

[powersurge]

Yes, I use the "Battery Tender" and have a set of quick release leads to all my cars so that I can plug in all my car batteries instantly..

 

[DesertSprings]

In the future, I suggest that you get a charger, and charge it completely.

Good advice! Unfortunately, the forum software links to EVSEs for sale at Amazon when it encounters the word "charger". I will instead highly recommend the BatteryMinder 1500 to do the job.

That's the one I ordered this weekend, after having my battery replaced on my 2015 after just 11 months. My commute is 13 miles each way, which apparently isn't enough to keep the battery healthy.

 

[DesertSprings]

Yes, I use the "Battery Tender" and have a set of quick release leads to all my cars so that I can plug in all my car batteries instantly..

What/where did you connect the negative lead to that allows for a permanent mount?

 

[RegGuheert]

What/where did you connect the negative lead to that allows for a permanent mount?

That's a very good question! I intended to do that on our MY2011, but the ground lug which connects to the top of the DC/DC converter has a captive washer attached. Without being able to put the battery lead *between* the lug and the washer I was concerned I might disrupt the grounding of the vehicle.

 

[Newporttom]

Went to dealer and they checked battery before selling me the new one and they said I didn't need one. Battery Health good, CCA 323. Only issue they saw was 12.38 v reading.

Car is 4 years old. 50K miles. New traction battery 1 month ago. Morning of the check it finished 100% at 6;30. I them drove it to dealer 10 miles away at 1 PM. Radio and driver seat heat on low were on.

There suggestion was to check again in 3 months. Any thoughts?

You never provided much information on why you thought you needed a new 12V battery :?:
Why do you think you need one :?:
Did you discuss that in another topic :?:

I would be more confident in the dealer if their battery test gave you an estimate of 12V capacity rather than CCA.
But possible the 12V is OK.

The only reason I was going to replace the battery was because the car was 4 years old. I've had no issues. Here's the printout if it helps any.

Well it's now 15 months later. Car is 5 1/4 years old. Thinking I should just call dealer and have new installed just to be safe.

 

[jjeff]

If everything is working and looks good I'd be tempted to just keep going with the factory battery. I know with my last 3 ICE vehicles the factory battery lasted 8+ years before failure. Yes I know a Leaf is different but if it's working, why tempt fate I guess if you were worried about being stranded you could invest in a $40 Lithium battery booster, it's what I have in my '13 Leaf as an emergency backup in case the main 12v battery dies(or even just gets run down for some unknown reason). Before the Li booster I had a $29 lead acid version but being lead acid it would require bi-monthly charges to keep it up and was also quite a bit heavier and bulkier than the little/light Li version.

 

[SageBrush]

Are headlights enough load for the voltage test ?

 

[jjeff]

I had a standard lead-acid battery (OEM) last 10 years in the car I traded in for my Leaf.

I would wonder what early warning signs you would get for the 12V battery is on its last legs

That's nice, but I sure wouldn't advise anyone to wait 10 years (or even 5) to replace a 12v lead-acid battery

In an ICE car, you might get a clue that the 12v battery is going bad from (poor) starter cranking, etc., but in an EV, the warning signs may not be so obvious. In fact, they may not even make sense (difficult to troubleshoot)! Bottom line: if there was ever a car worth spending a few extra $$ to replace the 12v lead-acid with a Lithium, the Leaf is it. See my blog post for more details about my experience.

http://stanton.myevblog.com/2012/01/16/getting-the-lead-out/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Stanton, do you have a current link to your post about your battery experience? Looks like all the Li batteries I found have a screw top, how did you adapt that to the round automotive type post found on our Leafs?
I was thinking of a yellow top Optima but at over $200 on Amazon and people here saying they aren't what they used to be, well I thought my money might be better spent on something else

 

[baustin]

I replaced my original battery with a Bosch AGM Plus with 4 year warranty from Pep Boys. They run periodic discounts/sales. I ordered online and paid in store for about $135 with free installation. I had originally planned to put in an Optima Yellow Top, but even with the discount it was more money with only a three year warranty. When I first decided on the Optima, they were about $150 from Amazon, but when It came time to get one, they were over $200. The Bosch has been in about 6 week with no issues, and no TCU resets needed since installing it.

 

[GerryAZ]

I replaced my original battery with a Bosch AGM Plus with 4 year warranty from Pep Boys. They run periodic discounts/sales. I ordered online and paid in store for about $135 with free installation. I had originally planned to put in an Optima Yellow Top, but even with the discount it was more money with only a three year warranty. When I first decided on the Optima, they were about $150 from Amazon, but when It came time to get one, they were over $200. The Bosch has been in about 6 week with no issues, and no TCU resets needed since installing it.

I took advantage of the Pep Boys sale, but chose the Yellow Top Optima because the salesman was concerned that the Bosch AGM Plus was not listed in their online fitment guide for the 2015 LEAF. Sale prices were almost the same, but Bosch has 4-year while Optima has 3-year full replacement warranty. I have been using Optimas in other vehicles for many years, but this might be the first one I have purchased that was made in Mexico. So far so good, but it will be a year or two before I know if the quality is up to previous levels.

 

[Stanton]

Stanton, do you have a current link to your post about your battery experience? Looks like all the Li batteries I found have a screw top, how did you adapt that to the round automotive type post found on our Leafs?
I was thinking of a yellow top Optima but at over $200 on Amazon and people here saying they aren't what they used to be, well I thought my money might be better spent on something else

Unfortunately, I had to take down my blog due to excessive spam
However, here's a link to the MNL forum topic that generated a lot of discussion http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=11999
There's a real paradigm shift that happens when you talk about 12v starter batteries in EV's vs. ICE (other than they have to fit the same charging profile); I honestly expect my (current) 12v LiFePO4 battery to last the life of my Leaf (I'm on my second traction battery pack, so that could easily be 10 years).
That's another way of saying: your top consideration can't be cost (you will never find a good Lithium 12v battery for the $ you mention above).

 

[jjeff]

Stanton, do you have a current link to your post about your battery experience? Looks like all the Li batteries I found have a screw top, how did you adapt that to the round automotive type post found on our Leafs?
I was thinking of a yellow top Optima but at over $200 on Amazon and people here saying they aren't what they used to be, well I thought my money might be better spent on something else

Unfortunately, I had to take down my blog due to excessive spam
However, here's a link to the MNL forum topic that generated a lot of discussion http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=11999
There's a real paradigm shift that happens when you talk about 12v starter batteries in EV's vs. ICE (other than they have to fit the same charging profile); I honestly expect my (current) 12v LiFePO4 battery to last the life of my Leaf (I'm on my second traction battery pack, so that could easily be 10 years).
That's another way of saying: your top consideration can't be cost (you will never find a good Lithium 12v battery for the $ you mention above).

Thanks, yes I found your thread after posting. I have to say at first I was considering one of those ~$200 Li batts from Amazon but after reading your thread I decided against it, just too low a Ah capacity. The cost of a decent sized 12v Li batt is just more than I can justify so I think I'll just go with a Pb gel cell, either the overpriced yellow top Optima(currently ~$225) or maybe a cheaper option like the Bosch or maybe something else like the Excide. It will probably end up being the Optima due to the fact I've used them in the past and had good luck and they are also easily available from places I shop
I did enjoy reading your thread though and all the reasons to go one way or the other, of course I could also probably just go with a OEM type of Pb acid battery but even those aren't as cheap as they used to be, no more $39 12v Champion batteries to be found.....

 

[GerryAZ]

Jjeff,

Just so we don't confuse anyone, the Bosch and Optima are both AGM batteries (not gel cells). I don't think there are any major manufacturers selling gel batteries for automotive use. Some motorcycle manufacturers supplied true gel cell batteries in new bikes 10-15 years ago, but they were not reliable. The gel battery would be unable to start the engine if it was not well charged because the gel electrolyte becomes stratified (after cold start and short trip, for example), but would be fine after sustained charging.

Gel cells are better suited to low current standby use like small security systems where they are normally kept on float charge for extended time and rarely need to supply current. Gel cells typically need higher float voltages than conventional lead acid flooded or AGM batteries. The relatively low float voltage of the DC-DC converter in the LEAF is ideal for AGM and OK for flooded batteries, but would likely not keep a gel battery adequately charged.

I am sure either the Bosch or Optima AGM battery will work out well for you.

 

[jjeff]

Jjeff,

Just so we don't confuse anyone, the Bosch and Optima are both AGM batteries (not gel cells). I don't think there are any major manufacturers selling gel batteries for automotive use. Some motorcycle manufacturers supplied true gel cell batteries in new bikes 10-15 years ago, but they were not reliable. The gel battery would be unable to start the engine if it was not well charged because the gel electrolyte becomes stratified (after cold start and short trip, for example), but would be fine after sustained charging.

Gel cells are better suited to low current standby use like small security systems where they are normally kept on float charge for extended time and rarely need to supply current. Gel cells typically need higher float voltages than conventional lead acid flooded or AGM batteries. The relatively low float voltage of the DC-DC converter in the LEAF is ideal for AGM and OK for flooded batteries, but would likely not keep a gel battery adequately charged.

I am sure either the Bosch or Optima AGM battery will work out well for you.

Thanks for the explanation. I've used gel cell batteries for years, mostly in security and fire alarm applications where they are constantly charged just waiting for a power outage, they can also be used in all positions(don't have a liquid acid like the AGMs) so I just figured the AGM batteries where larger versions of the little 6ah 12v gel cells I've used, sounds like not.
I went looking for a replacement 12v battery today at a local "farm" type store. They had a couple different brands of AGM batteries but not in the 51R size, the only battery in the 51R size was a flooded lead acid for $115. I passed and will check at a couple other local stores for an AGM and if they are too expensive locally I'll probably just go the Optima route from Amazon. Several years back I replaced the 12v battery in our Prius with a yellow top Optima from Amazon and it's worked flawlessly ever since. The Prius originally used a flooded lead acid but as it was mounted in the passenger compartment was a special battery with a vent tube that ran underneath the car to vent any acid fumes. The replacement AGM didn't have to be vented which made it an ideal replacement for the Prius. Of course, our Leafs wouldn't have to be remotely vented but I'd still prefer a battery that didn't produce acid fumes when charged.

 

[Nubo]

...I went looking for a replacement 12v battery today at a local "farm" type store. They had a couple different brands of AGM batteries but not in the 51R size, the only battery in the 51R size was a flooded lead acid for $115. I passed and will check at a couple other local stores for an AGM and if they are too expensive locally I'll probably just go the Optima route from Amazon. ...

Speaking of "farm stores", it seems to me the "Rural King" AGM 51R may be the same battery as the Bosch AGM Platinum, but a cheaper price, the tradeoff being a lesser warranty. https://www.ruralking.com/battery-auto-agm-rk-agm51r.html

 

[baustin]

If you have a Pep Boys in your area, the Bosch 51R 4 year AGM is currently on sale for $133.

 

[Bob]

If you want your lead-acid battery to last forever, just add a charging port and plug it into a float charger once every other day. You don't need a fancy charger. Any float charger will work fine, but the Battery Tender line is excellent.

As a sweeping generalization, a typical lead-acid battery will last 500-1000 charge and discharge cycles if only 50% discharged, while a typical lithium battery will last 3000-5000 charge and discharge cycles (insert lots of disclaimers and exceptions here). If you occasionally drain lead-acid batteries more than 50%, their life will be drastically shortened. So if you don't plan to take special care of the battery, a lithium battery may be worth the extra money.

The above generalizations come from this link. If you disagree, please argue with him, not me.
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/lead-acid-vs-lithium-ion-batteries-robert-bean

Bob